www.ditl.org

So I decided to work my way through all of Trek again, starting with Enterprise (get the worst out of the way first right?) and I just watched the episode Cogenitor, and I thought the episode raised some interesting points and wanted to get the opinion of the crew.

A recap for those of you who haven't seen the episode in a while. The Enterprise is studying a hyper-giant star when they find another race of peaceful aliens, the Vissians, also studying the star. The plot then splits in two to follow Captain Archer going with the Vissian captain in a special shuttle the Vissians have for exploring near and within the photosphere of the star. The two rapidly build a strong rapport during the few days. The other half of the plot follows Trip who is introduced to the titular cogenitor, a member of a third gender in vissian society that is essentially in a form a sexual slavery. The cogenetors are shipped around from one family to another to perform their function in the mating process, they are not given an education, self-determination, or even names. Trip decides that this is a violation of the cogenetors rights after seeing that there is no difference in neurological capacity and teaches the cogenetor how to read, shows it a movie, introduces it to music, poetry, and exploration.

Upon learning what he's done the Vissian's ban Tucker from their ship and bring the cogenetor back. We then learn that the cogenetor is upset because the Vissians have refused to allow it to continue to learn nor even to allow it to continue having access to music, or art. In response, the cogenetor runs away and asks for asylum on Enterprise. Trip summarily grants the request creating a diplomatic incident when Archer returns. The Vissians obviously demand the return of the cogenetor as reproduction is impossible without one and the family in question has been waiting years for the services of one, but Archer tells them that he must also consider a request for asylum by someone who feels they haven't been treated fairly. A reference is made to the stewards appearing to be servants to one who is unfamiliar with Earths culture, making the case that Archer can't fairly judge what is right or wrong in a culture he knows nothing about. It is also made fairly clear that granting the cogenetor asylum would serve to cripple the progress that had been made in their relations, and possibly go so far as to create a major incident.

In the end Archer decides not to grant Asylum, and returns the cogenetor. The episode ends with learning that the cogenetor committed suicide not long after, and Archer blames Trip for the cogenetor's death, as well as for preventing the conception of a new life.

So my questions for you:

1) Was what the Vissians were doing a violation of the rights of the cogenetor? I don't just mean lawfully, obviously they weren't breaking their own laws. Essentially does the cogenetor have the rights of a sentient being and were they being violated.

2) Was Tucker way out of line in educating the cogenetor, or was it part of his responsibility to oppose the violation of the rights of another sentient being?

3) While the cogenetor didn't ask to be educated, it did ask for asylum (with the evidence that it was aware of what that meant and the consequences of of the decision). Given this, did Archer make the correct decision giving the cogenetor back, knowing that a sentient being was essentially being put back into a life of slavery and was now educated enough to realize it, or was maintaining the strong diplomatic relations that had been forged important enough to justify it.

4) Was Trip responsible for the suicide? If he is, is Archer also partially responsible for forcing the cogenetor back into that life?

My thoughts on it, (and do note the episode was finishing when I started writing this), are this:

1) I do think that what was going on was a violation of the cogenetors rights. The episode clearly demonstrated that the cogenetor was capable of higher function, yet the society as a whole seems to disenfranchise them and keep them in a life of eternal servitude in order to prevent their own lives interfering with the desires of the rest of the population.

2) It was not Tucker's place to take action. He wasn't aware of the full cultural picture of what was going on. And while I will give him credit this time for actually taking the time to see if the cogenetor was capable of higher intelligent function before just rushing to the conclusion that it was being unfairly denied education, he shouldn't have taken it upon himself to "right the wrong." At the very least he should have let T'Pol and Archer know what he thought was happening and consulted with them before action was taken.

3) I honestly don't know about this one. I feel like it was wrong of him to not grant asylum to the cogenetor, but I can also appreciate the idea of keeping the dialogue open so maybe the problem can be assessed on another day, perhaps when it would serve to help all of the cogenetors and not just that one.

4) I am also torn about Trip's guilt in the resulting suicide. While he was in the wrong to take the action, I also agree that he was fixing and injustice. There's also the fact that all it took from him was a little push, to get the cogenetor to start reading and then it was all he could do to keep providing it with the intellectual stimulation it clearly craved. I'm also not sure that I believe that by showing you something you didn't know you didn't have, I'm responsible for you being unhappy you don't have it. However, if we are blaming Trip for this, then I don't think he's alone. Archer was the one who made the decision to send it back when he knew that it understood what kind of life it was returning to.

So what are your thoughts? (I also apologize for any references to the cogenetor being a "she", that was the general usage during the episode and I've tried to keep it gender neutral but I might not have caught them all).

1) By human standards, yes, absolutely. It's pretty clear that the cogenitors are essentially slaves.

But then they aren't human, so why would human standards apply? You could argue that it's their society, and in their society obviously the cogenitor's rights aren't being violated because the cogenitors have no right to violate.

However, I'd go further than that and say that the Vissian society is obviously somewhat flawed. There's a whole section of society that is deprived freedom... and obviously wants freedom. I'd condemn them on that basis - not that they are not up to human standards, but rather that the system is flawed even on its own terms.

2) Legally, I'd expect that whilst they are on the NX-01 he was within his rights. Much as today, if a man brought his slave to the UK, then that person wouldn't be a slave whilst in the country, and could legally walk away any time they liked. On the NX-01 human law applies, and I'd imagine human law of the time doesn't recognise slavery.

Now in TOS and TNG, one might argue that the Prime Directive would mean that the slave would still be a slave, since freeing them might be considered interference. Or it might not - I'm not sure it's ever been explored in any detail. Really the only example I can think of offhand is The Perfect Mate, where Picard appeared pretty upset at the thought that Kamala might not have had personal freedom.

On a purely moral basis, I think Trip was in the right. Screw slavery anyway; free the Cogenitors, and damn the consequences.

3) Hell no. Archer really should have granted the asylum request. Albeit that doing so might have gotten his ship blown up. It's always been the case in Trek that asylum requests are granted every time - the dialogue usually seems to indicate that the Captain HAS to granty asylum when asked. To refuse asylum and give a slave back to his/her owners? Screw that.

As I said in my ep review, Archer's response to Trip's "I was only doing what I thought you would do" was along the lines of "Then I've set a pretty bad example around here." Yeah, man, you said it. You've set a HORRIBLE example on that ship, and this is another example.

4) No, Trip wasn't. Archer was. See above.

It's worth noting that when Trip starts teaching the cogenetor how to read he does so by sneaking around on the Vissian ship. It isn't until a few days later that the cogenetor asks to see enterprise and he brings it back to the ship.

Good point, I'd forgotten that.

I wonder what would have happened if they'd caught him on their ship teaching the Cogenitor right at the start, and arrested him? Somehow I can't see Archer just letting them keep him and leave... but then, what could he really do? Legally he wouldn't have a leg to stand on, and I can't imagine the NX-01 would have stood much of a chance against the Vissian ship if he felt like using force.

Graham Kennedy wrote:Good point, I'd forgotten that.

I wonder what would have happened if they'd caught him on their ship teaching the Cogenitor right at the start, and arrested him? Somehow I can't see Archer just letting them keep him and leave... but then, what could he really do? Legally he wouldn't have a leg to stand on, and I can't imagine the NX-01 would have stood much of a chance against the Vissian ship if he felt like using force.

That probably would have been a much more interesting episode....

probably why they didn't go with that idea.

Yes, it wouldn't do to have Enterprise be any good. It would violate tradition!

Graham Kennedy wrote:Good point, I'd forgotten that.

I wonder what would have happened if they'd caught him on their ship teaching the Cogenitor right at the start, and arrested him? Somehow I can't see Archer just letting them keep him and leave... but then, what could he really do? Legally he wouldn't have a leg to stand on, and I can't imagine the NX-01 would have stood much of a chance against the Vissian ship if he felt like using force.

Interestinlgly when something like that happens to the human crew they are usually in the fault because they not knowing they broke any law isn't an excuse, but if an alien comits such a blunder it's usually not his/her fault...just didn't know any better.


My point is....this seems all incredibly amateurish and petty to me. If they have any contact and are even magically able to speak with everyone they come across...how about getting a few things out of the way first? You want to visit? Sure why not, but hey...we have those progenitors on the ship. Just avoid them please. Do not teach them anything. Are you cool with that?

I mean the whole episode - as far as I can remember - sets them up as pretty nice and likable chaps, very prudent and nice. But then they got slighted a bit (which is to be bloody expected when dealing with aliens not knowing your culture) and they transform into ultra-hardcore childs demanding this and that and threatening to blow your ship up.... I find that unrealistic.

Cultural misunderstandings are always going to happen - without knowing their culture you wouldn't even know what questions to ask or what facts to tell them. For instance, why would the Vissians warn them about cogenitors? It's so normal to them that it wouldn't occur to them to tell Archer in advance, any more than Archer would know to ask.

That's one moment I liked about the episode actually, where the Vissian captain mentions the slaves that work on the ship. He just assumed that that's what they were, without thinking to ask. Just like Archer never thought to tell him that they weren't.

Hmm...good point. I guess what I was trying to say is that such cultural misunderstandings will always happen and are to be expected. How they are handled though is highly unprofessional. Usually they involve the offended party threatening to destroy the enterprise, break off all diplomatic relation or kill a crewmember.

So a family is waiting a couple of years for their progenitor. Which is suddenly not available anymore because of an encounter with another species who didn't know what they were doing when teaching him/her to read etc. And while this is regretable, no sane cutlure would take this as reason enough to go batshitcrazy on people who are potentially.....really nice chaps, trading parters and all around peacefull and non-threatening folks in a galaxy seemingly filled with A-holes. (Kinda why I didn't like Enterprise...everyone they encountered was pretty much a dick, which was kinda fitting since Archer also was one....)


Imho those "encounters" are too constructed. I mean there is a difference between meddling in ones culture and just having contact with each other. Tucker wasn't the leader of a slave rebellion, he basically just talked to a person. That he unknowingly caused some harm is regrettable, but making a major diplomatic incident out of that is laughable.

Kosciuszko wasn't trying to be an American hero nor did he especially hate the British; but no matter his motivations, the results were what they were. To the man himself, he was just a guy espousing what he saw was right, but to the British no doubt he was a foreign national terrorist sympathizer. Everything can be anything depending on your point of view. Yes, it feels contrived that almost every single alien culture believes any slight is an intentional insult and deserves to be met with threats of violence; but it hardly beggars belief that some do.