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Since we are discussing the merits of ships, I want to ask a question that has been plaguing me for a year and a half.

The Norway, Steamrunner, and Saber Classes

What is the friggin' point? What are these ships SUPPOSED to be doing?

Saber is a scout that it slow and BARELY armed

Norway and Steamrunner are WAY under armed for galaxy exploration, to small for a long duration mission, and serve no identifiable purpose!

Why are these ships here, and what are they good for?

Mark wrote:Since we are discussing the merits of ships, I want to ask a question that has been plaguing me for a year and a half.

The Norway, Steamrunner, and Saber Classes

What is the friggin' point? What are these ships SUPPOSED to be doing?

Saber is a scout that it slow and BARELY armed

Norway and Steamrunner are WAY under armed for galaxy exploration, to small for a long duration mission, and serve no identifiable purpose!

Why are these ships here, and what are they good for?

How do we even know this much about them?

I don't even remember any episodes they were in.

More the marrier I guess?

They were blown to hell in FC, then made some follow up appearances in DS9 fleet scenes. Granted, most of what I'm pulling is from GK's calcs on the main site, but the argument still stands. What would these ships have brought to the table?

Mark wrote:They were blown to hell in FC, then made some follow up appearances in DS9 fleet scenes. Granted, most of what I'm pulling is from GK's calcs on the main site, but the argument still stands. What would these ships have brought to the table?

And I think you win, I have no idea.

Evidently Starfleet wanted a replacement for the Miranda (in the 2340's the Miranda was 70+ years past its service life) and found the Steamrunner to fit the bill. I see it as a fleet escort vessel and perhaps a border-patrol vessel for sparsely populated areas of the Federation.

Gotta stand up for her!!!

I'm quite fond of the Steamrunner's looks, but have a hard time wondering why they'd design a new ship from scratch to fit the bill an older ship could just as easily (and in some cases more effectively) accomplish the same thing.

True, but there had to be a natural progression from the Miranda to, say, the Intrepid. Maybe it's just a numbers game...

The Norway and Saber strike me as ultimately superfluous ships. The Steamrunner's strike me as a sort of destroyer to take the reins of the Miranda. They were intended to replace them, but found them to be too costly over the Miranda's.

It seems to me the cost to maintain an older fleet of Mirandas would outweigh the cost of the Steamrunners, but I never was good at 24th century economics... I know the Steamrunner has a shuttle bay - does the Miranda have one as well? That would be a major advantage...

all i know is that out universe perspective from alex jaeger et al, about there being a need for a fleet battle but with the proponents being visually very distinct from the sovereign class.
in-universe, i have no idea, maybe sabers were made to fill a slightly heavier role than the federation fighters seen during the dominion war?

steamrunner wrote:It seems to me the cost to maintain an older fleet of Mirandas would outweigh the cost of the Steamrunners, but I never was good at 24th century economics... I know the Steamrunner has a shuttle bay - does the Miranda have one as well? That would be a major advantage...

It def. has 2 shuttlebays.

Nice find.

I'm not sure if those are hangars or escape pod bays. They were used as the latter in Emissary, but it wasn't clear whether they were dedicated escape pods or shuttles being used as such.

Mark wrote:Saber is a scout that it slow and BARELY armed

Norway and Steamrunner are WAY under armed for galaxy exploration, to small for a long duration mission, and serve no identifiable purpose!

By the standards of the late 2370's, sure. The F-15 is a less capable strike fighter than the F-22, as well - but it doesn't mean that there was no good reason to ever make the F-15. I can't really argue for the Saber, because I feel the same way. The Steamrunner sure seems to be a commensurate adjunct ship for its time... the Miranda to the Ambassador's Connie, for example. If we judge it by its contemporary "competition," I don't think it's that useless at all.

Norway is a tough call. With the decrease in saucer volume that goes with going from a disc to a wedge-shaped primary hull, I agree that it is probably not staffed or equipped for long duration missions. Nor is an Oberth, or Nova, or Freedom or... There is probably either a research, contact, or destroyer-type role that it fills.

Captain Seafort wrote:I'm not sure if those are hangars or escape pod bays. They were used as the latter in Emissary, but it wasn't clear whether they were dedicated escape pods or shuttles being used as such.

This really doesn't answer that, but this is a CGI interior of the Miranda shuttle bay, can't find any pictures of a shuttle leaving a Miranda, but it didn't really get an important enough role or enough screen time to show that really.

CGI interior of Miranda shuttle bay(fan made)