You're a Captain,you get to pick your starship. Which class?

[Captain Seafort]

Weird. Guess it's true what they say about fate protecting fools.

[Deepcrush]

Jumping into the open ocean is one thing for me. Jumping next to a giant cliff of sharp painful death is another... NO THANKS YOU VERY MUCH!

[Captain Seafort]

Going anywhere near cyanide point is stupid, let alone jumping off it.

[Mikey]

When I was a kid, I used to dive competitively from a little more than half that height regularly (10m springboard and platform.) Granted it was into a pool, but surface tension is surface tension. You can hit the water feet-first without any injury at all, as long as your toes are together and pointed; and you can hit the water head first with not problem, as long as your hands are together and extended. If you have enough pressure on the water, exerted from a small enough area (e.g., pointed toes or fingers,) no problem.

[Deepcrush]

Boot toes down and cross your arms!

[Mikey]

That's the ticket. And there's a whole other danger of hitting the water that hard feet-first with your legs apart. Let's just say it involves forcing water the wrong way into the alimentary canal at very high pressure...

[Deepcrush]

[Teaos]

People say its just like hitting cement, but I've seen a couple of bad dives from 10m where the people were just winded when they landed on what looked about 45 degrees. Hardly like hitting cement.

[Deepcrush]

Its all about breaking the surface of the water at the smallest point. Like an arrow or spear tip punching through flesh.

[Teaos]

Let's not have warp cores and things then which could explode and kill people? Oh... Wait...
They do the same job.

WTF?

Lets not have warp cores because they can kill people?

Now your just being deliberatly stupid.

They need a warp core to power the ship to the needed levels. They don't need gravity plating that can go up to 100g's.

They both create acceleration. They do the same thing. Simple concept.

So?

They have a similar principle behind them. That as you like to say is totally and 100% percent irrelivant.

You are stating that the gravity plating could go up to 100g's, well achually you claimed it could go up to several million, but I'll be nice and ignore that.

Yes, it is with in starfleets power to make it that powerful.

It is my point though that they wouldnt.

It has ZERO reason to be built to be able to go that high, by doing so you put your crew and ship is serious danger if it malfuntions even for a second.

The gravity plating is there for one reason and one reason only, to provide a normal earth like gravity for the crew to work in.

The dampeners are a totally different system and I have no idea why you even brought them up.

Occams razor stats the simplist answer is the correct one. How is it simpler for a ship to have plating hundreds or even millions of times more robust than needed?

Not only is it not needed, its dangerous to have.

Add to that the fact we have never seen the gravity in a ship go any more than about 10g's (on the mirror universe which cant count as canon) would prove my point nicely.

It mey be possible, but it isnt true in current star fleet ships.

They both create gravity. Why are we even discussing this? It is empirical fact, they both create gravity, they do the same thing. The end. There is no shades of grey in this.

How is this a relivant point? My toaster and my electric blanket both produce heat, thus they do the same thing and are by your logic the same thing... oh wait.

And (which I did notice you failed to reply to), you can just turn off the inertial dampers in a section, and accelerate the ship. Even relatively small acceleration will kill them an in instant (say... 100g?)

Evidence please? We have never seen the dampeners have a selective area, it seems to be an all or nothing thing across the ship.

Were as we HAVE seen the gravity change in selective areas.

[Thorin]

They need a warp core to power the ship to the needed levels. They don't need gravity plating that can go up to 100g's.

They do however need inertial dampers, which serve the exact same function as gravity plating, to go up to millions of g's. Inertial dampers must cover every area on the entire ship because each area/section/corridor/room will have a different acceleration acting upon it as the ship moves about. Hence, each section must have separate inertial dampers with different settings to the others. Thus they must act indepandantly, otherwise as the ship does a clockwise spin pivoting around engineering, say, those in ten forward are going splat, those near the warp core are just going to get dizzy.

The fact is, you're talking to a current physics undergrad about gravity, inertia, acceleration, and torque, and to be honest, you don't have a clue, as per your lack of understanding on what gravity is and your analogy with toasters and heat.

Inertial dampers can create increadible acceleration/counter-acceleration/gravity - irrefutable.
They can act independantly - irrefutable.
Whether they're the same as gravity plating is irrelevant, they probably are because they both create acceleration on mass.

Gravity, whatever the hell creates it (it doesn't matter what actually does!), thus, can be used to subdue or kill intruders. The end.

[Teaos]

They do however need inertial dampers,

And you realise that I was never debating dampeners?

You realise that this debate started off as, and has always been about gravity plating being able to be cranked up to hundreds or millions of g's.

A fact that I sounds proved wrong and you were unable to debate.

I dont give a shit about the dampeners, infact I said several times they can obviously go that high.

The fact is, you're talking to a current physics undergrad about gravity, inertia, acceleration, and torque, and to be honest, you don't have a clue, as per your lack of understanding on what gravity is and your analogy with toasters and heat.

Funny I thought I was debating some who didnt have a clue about how two different parts of the ship have nothing to do with each other.

Get a clue.

And I really don't give a shit if your studying physics. Fact is no one knows what causes gravity (at least until the LHC gets turned on) and the fact is we are debating about a sci-fi universe that isnt dependent on our very low level understanding on gravity.


But here is something for you to ponder, gravity is theorised to be caused by the higgs boson which is tied into the higgs field.

The dampeners could work by decoupling the whole ship from the field. Thus it wouldnt be effected by acceleration. The only acceleration on the ship would be caused by the gravity plating.

So the fact is, you have no fucking idea how any of the systems in the ship work.

My inital and only point stands, the gravity plating on the ship has never been shown, and logically, wouldnt be able to go to hundred or millions of G's even though they may be capable of building it so it could.

[Thorin]

I thought the initial debate was about using gravity to crush to people, at least that's what I was getting at. Whether it's gravity plating or inertial dampers doesn't matter, like I've said all along. The fact you've changed tact now and gone for "gravity plating couldn't do it, though inertial dampers could" speaks volumes - you did actually claim the inertial dampers couldn't crush people - as each system wasn't separate. Backpedalling.

For the record, I stopped reading the rest of your post after you started talking like you knew anything about theoretical physics (specifically, your very intruguing take on the higgs boson - maybe I should pass on your informed opinion on it to my gravitation professor?)

Really, stick to what you know. You've shown that gravity isn't your forte.

[Teaos]

I thought the initial debate was about using gravity to crush to people, at least that's what I was getting at. Whether it's gravity plating or inertial dampers doesn't matter, like I've said all along. The fact you've changed tact now and gone for "gravity plating couldn't do it, though inertial dampers could" speaks volumes - you did actually claim the inertial dampers couldn't crush people - as each system wasn't separate. Backpedalling.

ROFL.

I'm not the one who changed what the debate was about, I from the start made it 100% obvious I was talking about gravity plating and you know it.

Evidenced by the fact that you initally tried to claim gravity plating and the dampeners are the same thing.

Infact I said in several different posts that dampeners can obviously do what you claimed but that the graivty plating can't.

Do you want me to get the quotes or are you willing to admit you are full of shit?

I proved you wrong and you went "Well the gravity plating might not be able to but the dampeners could!"

Nice try but unfortunatly for you I have a memory slightly better than a goldfish.

For the record, I stopped reading the rest of your post after you started talking like you knew anything about theoretical physics (specifically, your very intruguing take on the higgs boson - maybe I should pass on your informed opinion on it to my gravitation professor?)

You know that by trying to act smarter while showing what an idiot you are not only makes you look like a moron but also a liar.

If you didnt read the post you wouldnt have known I brought up the higgs field/partical, considering there were only 2 lines after that I doubt you choose to give up there.

And show your lecturer if you wish, due to gravity being a total mystery at least for another 9 months he'll be unable to prove me wrong. Which was my point. We have no idea how the dampeners and gravity platng work and we don't even know the fine details of the force they are supposed to manipulate, so you claiming to know what your talking about is like you claiming to know about fairies.

By saying "well I study this so obviously know much more than you" with out providing any proof of your "superior" knowledge makes you like like a retard.

So for the record, I win, you lose.

Your either a liar or a moron.

Sorry my bad.

I guess you could be both.

[Thorin]

No understanding of relevant physics.
Check.