VOY: The Gift

[stitch626]

I feel it is quite plausible for Kim to be the highest ranking person in Ops. A lot of people died in the pilot, perhaps ops happened to get hit a bit harder than others.

[Captain Seafort]

I feel it is quite plausible for Kim to be the highest ranking person in Ops. A lot of people died in the pilot, perhaps ops happened to get hit a bit harder than others.

Plausible and sensible (and a good plot point to have the most inexperienced member of the ops staff suddenly booted to the top), but not what happened - Kim was the original ops officer.

[Mark]

Remember when O'Brian was testifying at Worf's hearing? They kept asking him what he would have done. Why? When would a Chief Petty Officer assume command of a starship in combat?

When it's a bloody small ship. Given that we know for a fact that there wasn't a single commissioned officer in the entire engineering staff, I wouldn't be surprised if only the command crew were commissioned.

If you look around the bridge, you SEE officers pips on collars.

And as for no commissioned officers being in the engineering dept, I'm afraid I'll need you to prove that statement.

And wasn't Nog originally assigned to O'Brians team?

[Captain Seafort]

And as for no commissioned officers being in the engineering dept, I'm afraid I'll need you to prove that statement.

From Starship Down:

O'BRIEN
With all due respect, I think
you're riding these men a bit too
hard. You have to understand,
they're out of their element.
They're not bridge officers, they
didn't go to Starfleet Academy.
They're Engineers. They're used
to being told to repair something,
and figuring out how to do it on
their own.

My emphasis. O'Brien is referring to the engineering team collectively

And wasn't Nog originally assigned to O'Brians team?

Before he went to the academy IIRC - and, while I can't remember the episode, O'Brien once commented that when Nog got back "I'll have to call the kid 'sir'" (might be paraphrased slightly).

[Mark]

So by that statement, only bridge officers go to the acadamy????

That's patently absurd!

Whoever wrote that MUST have been high.

[Tyyr]

I think it's more of an "and/or" statement. They aren't bridge officers and/or they didn't go to the academy. Two separate qualifications rather than one.

[Mark]

Refresh my memory........didn't those engineers have officers pips on their collars?

[Captain Seafort]

Nope.

[stitch626]

I feel it is quite plausible for Kim to be the highest ranking person in Ops. A lot of people died in the pilot, perhaps ops happened to get hit a bit harder than others.

Plausible and sensible (and a good plot point to have the most inexperienced member of the ops staff suddenly booted to the top), but not what happened - Kim was the original ops officer.

Oh... well... crap.

[SomosFuga]

So by that statement, only bridge officers go to the acadamy????

That's patently absurd!

Whoever wrote that MUST have been high.

2 separate statements.
Anyway if it is canon there is not much to argue about it.
What ep is that from?

[Mikey]

So while Sisko took over command of the Defiant it wasn't large enough for Starfleet to bother finding a Lt. Commander or the like to be chief engineer of a depart of a dozen enlisted men.

I think the Defiant itself is an odd situation. By it's size and complement, one might well expect it to be skippered by a commander if not even an experienced lieutenant. However, byt virtue of it being the hot new shiny toy in the UFP's box, one could expect it to be skippered by a prominent captain. In it's incarnation as the biggest shuttle attached to DS9, however, as Tyyr mentioned, one would expect it to be staffed by the station's extant command structure.

[Captain Seafort]

What ep is that from?

Starship Down - when the Defiant and a couple of bugs played Hunt for Red October in a gas giant

I think the Defiant itself is an odd situation. By it's size and complement, one might well expect it to be skippered by a commander if not even an experienced lieutenant. However, byt virtue of it being the hot new shiny toy in the UFP's box, one could expect it to be skippered by a prominent captain.

By size and compliment it rated a Lieutenant at best. Bumping that up to Lt Commander or Commander (as Strafleet did) based on the relative strength of the ship is reasonable.

In it's incarnation as the biggest shuttle attached to DS9, however, as Tyyr mentioned, one would expect it to be staffed by the station's extant command structure.

Why? They've got their own jobs to do.

[Mikey]

Why? They've got their own jobs to do.

Why? Because it was assigned as a vehicle for the use of the station staff, not as a separate entity attached to the station.

[Captain Seafort]

Why? Because it was assigned as a vehicle for the use of the station staff, not as a separate entity attached to the station.

And who, exactly, is doing everyone's jobs while they're off swanning around in the Defiant? Sisko disappearing off on his own is manageable, but 90% of the time the Defiant leaves she takes the station's Chief Engineer (and an unknown proportion of his staff), doctor and science officer, and frequently the 2iC as well. It got better later on, but DS9 still routinely lost its Chief Engineer and doctor - two of the most important posts. Bashir in particular was a serious loss since he seemed to be the only qualified doctor on the station.

[Mikey]

OK. I agree with you 100% But what does this have to do with anything? I never said any of it made sense. But the fact of the matter is that a) the Defiant was not a separately-crewed ship that was merely berthed at DS9 - it was the personal plaything of the command staff; and b) that the senior staff routinely took off to go mudbogging in their new toy, leaving the station without a command staff.