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Teaos wrote:Treid to watch it, couldnt make it past first few episodes...

Same here.

Definitely gotta go past the first few episodes.

Rail gun "rail(?)" I don't know. It's the railgun thing.


US Navy to publicly show their amazing railgun for the first time ever on February 4th. Damn. What a Valentine Day's gift!

Video of railgun firing.

Teaos wrote:Treid to watch it, couldnt make it past first few episodes...

That's a shame. It's not a perfect show by any means, but it was a ground-breaking one, and it is truly excellent in many respects.

It takes a bit to get going, but when it does? Ho-ly shit! 8)

Graham Kennedy wrote:

Teaos wrote:Treid to watch it, couldnt make it past first few episodes...

That's a shame. It's not a perfect show by any means, but it was a ground-breaking one, and it is truly excellent in many respects.

I'll have to try and give it another go. I have to say, of the few eps I've seen one or two were in true competition for some of the worst garbage I've seen on TV excepting sitcoms and reality shows.

Mikey wrote:

Graham Kennedy wrote:

Teaos wrote:Treid to watch it, couldnt make it past first few episodes...

That's a shame. It's not a perfect show by any means, but it was a ground-breaking one, and it is truly excellent in many respects.

I'll have to try and give it another go. I have to say, of the few eps I've seen one or two were in true competition for some of the worst garbage I've seen on TV excepting sitcoms and reality shows.

They whole series was filmed to be as cheap as possible without sacrificing quality. So some of the actors are not exactly top notch. Also filming each scene was on a tight schedule so if the actors got it in one take they would move on even if it wasn't great.

The commander of Babylon 4 has to be one of the top ten worse actors I have seen.

The CGI is bad and honestly was not great for its time either but it was unique in being completely CGI.

I think roughly 80% of the episodes were either written or some form of prep work was already done on them. Each character had a exit story as well if the actors wanted to leave.

Mikey wrote:

Graham Kennedy wrote:

Teaos wrote:Treid to watch it, couldnt make it past first few episodes...

That's a shame. It's not a perfect show by any means, but it was a ground-breaking one, and it is truly excellent in many respects.

I'll have to try and give it another go. I have to say, of the few eps I've seen one or two were in true competition for some of the worst garbage I've seen on TV excepting sitcoms and reality shows.

The production values aren't that great. Sets tend to look on the cheap side, and the CGI effects aren't great by today's standards - they actually get much, much better as the show goes on, but they're never up to the kind of CGI you see in Enterprise, say. Personally I approach them much as I approach the effects in TOS; they're good enough for me to suspend my disbelief.

Acting is variable. The leads are usually okay (Sheridan), good (Ivanova), or great (G'Kar, Londo). However, there are some small roles that are horribly written and acted. What always stuck out to me was bad guys. Not the big bad guys, who are often well done - Walter Koneig does EXCELLENT work as Bester, who is a great character. But whenever there's some standard henchman thug-type, they always seem to have horrible dialogue and horrible actors.

On the upside, B5 does a lot of things that most sci fi couldn't or wouldn't do. JMS obviously took a look at Star Trek and decided to play with what it does and doesn't do. So we get a station which has rich people and working class people, and even a zone where drop-outs, homeless people, etc live because they can't afford a ticket to leave the station. Hell, the B5 staff even have to worry about their budget. We get politics all over the place - there are elections, with people arguing about who they'll vote for. And every government in the show acts in its own self interest, always - there is NO presumption that Earth will obviously stand up for the weak or do what's morally right in any given situation (and after a couple of seasons... well, no spoilers, but Earthgov is not a happy place).

Nor are individuals any more 'evolved' than present day ones. One of the main characters on the show is a recovering alcoholic. Another becomes a drug addict. Most of them have an agenda, most of them are revealed to be hiding major secrets or outright lying their asses off to everyone around them at some point. Most of them screw up royally at some point. Some of them commit murder - sometimes on a grand scale. There are people you think of as "good guys" who slide into evil, and people who you think of as "bad guys" who redeem themselves. NOBODY on the show is exactly what they seem in the first few episodes.

Nor is there the artificial "frozen life" aspect. People have relationships, and fail in their relationships. People get promoted, get new jobs. People leave the station completely - leave Earthforce, set up a new life elsewhere, and never come back except to visit. And yet, remain major characters on the show. Everyone in the show grows, both in character and career. They feel like REAL people, in a REAL setting.

Oh, and there's the single best exploration telepathy in all of science fiction. Star Trek tends to just act like telepathy is this sense some people have, and the world carries on exactly as before. B5 points out that telepathy would lead to some pretty cataclysmic changes to society - and whilst it shows solutions, it never treats those solutions as perfect. Indeed, it suggests that the solutions may be worse than the problem.

Anyway, I've gone on and on. But that's because I think it may well be one of the best sci-fi shows ever made.

Of course, none of that means that it's going to be your thing. But I'd give it to the end of season 1, at least. By then, you will have had a few very tantalising plot threads dangled.

If you want a cut down version that skips the less important / less good episodes of season one, then try these :

"And the Sky Full of Stars"
"Deathwalker"
"Believers"
"Signs and Portents"
"Chrysalis"

That will give you a taste of some of season 1's better episodes, and some of the more important arc points. If you're not interested by then it's probably not the show for you.

Another season 1 episode I liked... Just because is the one with family having a sick son but their belief system doesn't allow any of their species to be cut let alone be operated on.

That's Believers.

Ahh cool. I could have looked it up but got lazy.

Graham Kennedy wrote:The production values aren't that great. Sets tend to look on the cheap side, and the CGI effects aren't great by today's standards - they actually get much, much better as the show goes on, but they're never up to the kind of CGI you see in Enterprise, say.

This isn't a problem for me. I grew up on TOS, Doctors 1 - 4, Space: 1999, and the original Battlestar Galactica with Lorne Greene. Great production values or effects can enhance a good show, but to me they can't break a show that's well-written and well-performed.

Graham Kennedy wrote:Acting is variable. The leads are usually okay (Sheridan), good (Ivanova), or great (G'Kar, Londo). However, there are some small roles that are horribly written and acted. What always stuck out to me was bad guys. Not the big bad guys, who are often well done - Walter Koneig does EXCELLENT work as Bester, who is a great character. But whenever there's some standard henchman thug-type, they always seem to have horrible dialogue and horrible actors.

This to me is a bigger problem. A great lead(s) IMHO can't support a show if he is surrounded by dross. Unlike SFX as I mentioned above, poor supporting cast or direction can and does break a show that otherwise has some good performances. My first experience with B5 was the original storyline involving Marcus Cole. While I have enjoyed Jason Carter's work at times in the past, I have to admit that he was absolutely awful - more than half of which wasn't his fault but rather that of the writing. Admittedly this left a bitter taste in my mouth toward any B5 I would see subsequent to that.

The rest of your analysis is material on which I obviously can't fairly comment, but you do a good job of making me reconsider my stance.

Not today, though, I'm going to watch the s2 premiere of Black Sails for the third and fourth time.

Graham Kennedy wrote:Cool and iconic pictures...


Workers break for lunch :

This has been made into a sculpture. I think I have a picture of it somewhere.

Thats not a sculpture, soon after this photo all those men looked into the eyes of a Basilisk... tragic.

Teaos wrote:Thats not a sculpture, soon after this photo all those men looked into the eyes of a Basilisk... tragic.

The actual basilisk is a harmless lizard, the mythical basilisk was reputed to be able to kill with a glance, but not petrify people.