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Ahh but he was raised as a ghoul...err Romulan slave

That never happened. Okay?

And even if it did, I don't think there would be any harm in collectively agreeing that such a hypothetical film would be shit, giving the creators of said movie the finger and agreeing never to mention such a travesty again.

Rochey wrote:

Ahh but he was raised as a ghoul...err Romulan slave

That never happened. Okay?

And even if it did, I don't think there would be any harm in collectively agreeing that such a hypothetical film would be s**t, giving the creators of said movie the finger and agreeing never to mention such a travesty again.

Paging Levar Burton to the watertower courtesy phone. Levar Burton please pick up the white courtesy phone at the water tower!

Am I the only one who thinks STX was a bit of a ripoff of STII, what with the blast from the past villain, the super powerful weapon, the nebula battle, and the best friend heroically sacrificing himself?

Lt. Staplic wrote:

Thorin wrote:If STXI try to use quantum theory to explain time travel it wouldn't be cool. There is no quantum theory of time travel, whatever the press and that crazy rotating laser 'physicist' may tell you.

It's not a quantom theory of Time travel, it uses quantom theory to explain the differences after Time travel has occurred.

By being there Nearo will change the quantom structure of the universe as it had happenned before possably producing several changes in the development of the time-line.

That's not quantum physics. That's stating that the presence of something would effect something else. Hell, that's not even relative physics, that's deterministic Newtonian mechanics.

Lazar wrote:Am I the only one who thinks STX was a bit of a ripoff of STII, what with the blast from the past villain, the super powerful weapon, the nebula battle, and the best friend heroically sacrificing himself?

No. The entire plot was a ripoff of II, with elements of VI, with all hint of quality ruthlessly expunged.

Well from what I can gather, Abrams is going to use an infinite universes theory of time travel (which allows us to go back into the past without causing paradoxes), rather than the single universe theory, which is common in science fiction, but which really makes no sense when you think about it. So some of the differences between the STXI universe and the TOS universe might be explained using a butterfly effect caused by Nero's time travel.

now I'm really thinking about starting a Temporal thread...

Thorin wrote:

Lt. Staplic wrote:

Thorin wrote:If STXI try to use quantum theory to explain time travel it wouldn't be cool. There is no quantum theory of time travel, whatever the press and that crazy rotating laser 'physicist' may tell you.

It's not a quantom theory of Time travel, it uses quantom theory to explain the differences after Time travel has occurred.

By being there Nearo will change the quantom structure of the universe as it had happenned before possably producing several changes in the development of the time-line.

That's not quantum physics. That's stating that the presence of something would effect something else. Hell, that's not even relative physics, that's deterministic Newtonian mechanics.

newtonian mechanics are physics...and yes it can be explained by the cause-effect idea of the past, but quantom mechanics also applies and accounts for the differences.

Lazar wrote:Well from what I can gather, Abrams is going to use an infinite universes theory of time travel (which allows us to go back into the past without causing paradoxes), rather than the single universe theory, which is common in science fiction, but which really makes no sense when you think about it. So some of the differences between the STXI universe and the TOS universe might be explained using a butterfly effect caused by Nero's time travel.

the infinite universes theory is the thing i was forgetting in my orriginal description about the time-travel thing. Infinite universes is proposed based on Heisenburg's uncertanty principal that states that you can never now the position and velocity of an electron, among other things, and (i think) Schrodingers idea that a partical takes every possable path between it's origin point and finishing point.

Because parcitals can (and do) exist in multiple places at once it means everything can (and does) exist in two places at once. An infinate amount of parallel universes would garentee that every path between our origon (birth) and destination (death) would occur, for every person. So one timeline would exist where Nero didn't travel back in time, which is the one we've followed for the most part, and one where he did, the new one from STXI.

That is how Quantum Mechanics explains the time travel and differences in the timeline.

Lazar wrote:Well from what I can gather, Abrams is going to use an infinite universes theory of time travel (which allows us to go back into the past without causing paradoxes), rather than the single universe theory, which is common in science fiction, but which really makes no sense when you think about it. So some of the differences between the STXI universe and the TOS universe might be explained using a butterfly effect caused by Nero's time travel.

That makes perfect (for sci-fi) sense. But it's got nothing to do with quantum physics.

right above you.

Lt. Staplic wrote: newtonian mechanics are physics...and yes it can be explained by the cause-effect idea of the past, but quantom mechanics also applies and accounts for the differences.

I didn't say otherwise, but while saying quantum physics is a blanket explanation for every single occurence is somewhat misleading, it's only applicable in a practicle manner for the very small. Saying "I am hungry" is attributable to quantum physics isn't particularly correct, the point of quantum physics is just that - quanta. The small and wave/particle duality.

Lazar wrote:the infinite universes theory is the thing i was forgetting in my orriginal description about the time-travel thing. Infinite universes is proposed based on Heisenburg's uncertanty principal that states that you can never now the position and velocity of an electron, among other things, and (i think) Schrodingers idea that a partical takes every possable path between it's origin point and finishing point.

Because parcitals can (and do) exist in multiple places at once it means everything can (and does) exist in two places at once. An infinate amount of parallel universes would garentee that every path between our origon (birth) and destination (death) would occur, for every person. So one timeline would exist where Nero didn't travel back in time, which is the one we've followed for the most part, and one where he did, the new one from STXI.

That is how Quantum Mechanics explains the time travel and differences in the timeline.

The infinite universe 'theory' is one thing, attributing that to quantum mechanics is a completely different thing. You are somehow asserting that parallel universe is 'correct' based on quantum mechanics, or more precisely wave functions, and that is just wrong.

You are correct assuming that if parallel universes did occur that time travel would create the butterfly effect. But attributing either time travel, parallel universes, or the butterfly effect to quantum physics is categorically incorrect.

Captain Seafort wrote:

Lazar wrote:Am I the only one who thinks STX was a bit of a ripoff of STII, what with the blast from the past villain, the super powerful weapon, the nebula battle, and the best friend heroically sacrificing himself?

No. The entire plot was a ripoff of II, with elements of VI, with all hint of quality ruthlessly expunged.

Not only was it a rip off, it came no where near the quality of the original.

*cough*

I wrote:The entire plot was a ripoff of II, with elements of VI, with all hint of quality ruthlessly expunged.

Yeah sorry, didn't mean to agree with you there

Thorin wrote:The infinite universe 'theory' is one thing, attributing that to quantum mechanics is a completely different thing. You are somehow asserting that parallel universe is 'correct' based on quantum mechanics, or more precisely wave functions, and that is just wrong.

You are correct assuming that if parallel universes did occur that time travel would create the butterfly effect. But attributing either time travel, parallel universes, or the butterfly effect to quantum physics is categorically incorrect.

except the theory of parallel universes uses quantum mechanics to justify itself. It's because of Heisenburg and Schrodinger's ideas about the electron that gives the type 2 parallel unierse (which is the one we're talking about in this sence) any validity (spelling?)

Lt. Staplic wrote:...(spelling?)

Which part?

You got "validity" right.