Carrier

[Mikey]

Once more, back into the fray...

It's a good idea, IF and only if we take as a given the importance of boots-on-the-ground warfare and surface-based installations. For strictly ship-to-ship actions, strike "aircraft" aren't effective enough to justify the R&D and production rather than simply more and greater starships.

[Deepcrush]

Deltaflyers would make for good multipurpose craft in almost anything. They can carry at least a squad of troops in their hold. Carry warheads, which means torps (PTs or QTs) for anti-ship support. Tough and small enough to support ground combat. In squadron size could easily engage a Jem'Bug if equiped with warheads. Cheap enough that even a ship of Voy size could build them so you don't need to take up space in a shipyard for them.

I picture them as the perfect ship for the job.

[Mikey]

For which job? Yes, they can support ground action - if there is enough of it to warrant a support craft. Yes, a squadron could probably take on a bug - but so can a single equivalent ship.

[Deepcrush]

Perfect for odd end jobs that you don't want to waste a capital ship on and that it is so easy to produce. Besides, what ground battle is there that you have an excuse not to have air-superiority? Even more so since a single pilot on the same shuttle that dropped the squad off can now achive air-superiority on his own.

[Mikey]

I'm not saying you're wrong, Deep. I'm saying that there are big IF's to be answered.

Besides, what ground battle is there that you have an excuse not to have air-superiority?

None at all. But how many were there at all? Is one or two enough to justify production of an all-new class?

[Deepcrush]

Its not a new class. Its the Deltaflyer.

What big IFs do you have in mind?

[Mikey]

Namely, the example I gave above. It is an eminently useful idea IF gorund-pounding is common (not just occasional) in 24th-century warfare.

BTW, I know there is ONE Delta Flyer. Don't try to tell me that Starfleet wouldn't still put it through an R&D/production process before rolling it out.

[Deepcrush]

Namely, the example I gave above. It is an eminently useful idea IF gorund-pounding is common (not just occasional) in 24th-century warfare.

Like any weapon, you don't keep it because you need it now. You have it for when you need it in the future.

BTW, I know there is ONE Delta Flyer. Don't try to tell me that Starfleet wouldn't still put it through an R&D/production process before rolling it out.

R&D wants a crack at it then fine. This thing can be built right on board a starship. If R&D wants to change something or has an upgrade in mind the work can be done in the field. R&D can carry at the same time as production and still be effective. Thats why I like this class so much. It's perfect for a support role which no other race seems to carry. This would give a huge advantage to the UFP in ground combat. Besides, every world the allies past they had to land troops to take it. Trek ground forces suffer horrible losses mostly due to thier lack of IQ. This ship could flip that problem around very nicely.

[Captain Seafort]

The problem with the Delta Flyer is that it was designed for a production run of one. There's no guarantee that it would be possible to mass-produce the ship, as would be necessary if you wanted to field it on the scale you're talking about.

[Deepcrush]

Voy, far far far very far from home without help and with support in anyway was able to build on in a week by just a few people. Not once but twice. Its not hard to build. More standardized parts and construction processes applied makes this things building short, simple and cheap.

[Captain Seafort]

Voy, far far far very far from home without help and with support in anyway was able to build on in a week by just a few people. Not once but twice. Its not hard to build.

I'm not saying it's difficult to build per se, but that it would be difficult to mass-produce. The fact that Voyager had to use what was available might even make that more difficult, due to eccentric materials, components and construction techniques.

More standardized parts and construction processes applied makes this things building short, simple and cheap.

Exactly - you'd have to use standarised materials and processes. Which would entail a significant redesign of the ship. This is meant to be operated by Academy graduates, not hotshot boy-racers with time to tinker constantly to fine tune the things.

[Deepcrush]

I'm not saying it's difficult to build per se, but that it would be difficult to mass-produce. The fact that Voyager had to use what was available might even make that more difficult, due to eccentric materials, components and construction techniques.

Where that is possible its not likely. Voy built two of these things at far different parts of the DQ. That means the reasource is what they can produce onboard. Mass production isn't the important part of it. Its the roles that it fills that matters most.

Exactly - you'd have to use standarised materials and processes. Which would entail a significant redesign of the ship. This is meant to be operated by Academy graduates, not hotshot boy-racers with time to tinker constantly to fine tune the things.

Who said Paris (or someone else) can't teach people to fly it?

[Captain Seafort]

Where that is possible its not likely. Voy built two of these things at far different parts of the DQ. That means the reasource is what they can produce onboard.

That, and whatever they can find or barter from the locals.

Mass production isn't the important part of it. Its the roles that it fills that matters most.

Exactly my point - Voyager didn't have to worry about designing the ship so it could be mass-produced. Starfleet, if it follows your suggestion, does.

Who said Paris (or someone else) can't teach people to fly it?

It isn't so much the flying (although would be a problem, given the extent to which the Flyer is tailored to Paris' style), so much as the amount of fine-tuning it needs. Look at the test flights the second Flyer was still being taken on even after it was in service and being assigned to missions.

[Mikey]

Seafort beat me to the obvious points of why Delta Flyer =/= mass-production ship unaltered.

As to this:
[quote=Deepcrush]Like any weapon, you don't keep it because you need it now. You have it for when you need it in the future.[/quote]

Let me just say... DUH! I know that. When there is evidence that ground-pounding will be more commonplace or important than it has been in what we've seen, then I will say there needs to be a carrier.

[Deepcrush]

I don't think you need a pure carrier in SF. A GCS with all that hanger space would work just fine. The Deltaflyers would work with SpecOps teams. An all out carrier wouldn't fill any need but a ship that could serve as a moble base for two or three dozen squads could be helpful. How often does SF send normal personel on missions that should be done by special forces. A ship with warp capable squad transports.