Why does everyone love the original TOS Enterprise so much?

[Tsukiyumi]

[Sionnach Glic]

Now that we have blasted off topic(like 4 pages ago), should the title of the thread be changed?

One thing you'll learn after a while here is that titles are rarely, if ever, changed. Seriously, don't be surprised if you go into a thread titled "Romulan Warbirds" and find people discussing how many Borg that Worf could kill with a Type 2 phaser.
Around here, it's known as "TR-116 Syndrome", due to the fact that the first thread to show this unique brand of off-topicness was about the TR-116 (well, for about two posts until it got derailed into about two dozen different subjects).

[Mark]

find people discussing how many Borg that Worf could kill with a Type 2 phaser.

None. He misses CONSTANTLY with a phaser at anything other than point blank. That's why his COs let him carry his blades.

[LaughingCheese]

Sovvy is gorgeous to be sure, but it disappoints me in a couple of ways, though.

For one, it's too small. I know, there's no rule saying Enterprises have to get bigger every time. But dammit, they should! Every Enterprise should be bigger, faster, more powerful, and just all around more kick ass than the last one. The Sov should have been scaled to have 30-50% more volume than the E-D, in my humble opinion.

For another, some aspects of the design nag at me. The quantum torpedo launcher has to be really small to fit where it is... and in fact most of the torpedo tubes have to be really small, especially on the refitted version where they have stuck all sorts of extras on. Small torp tubes bother me, because if they take up so little internal volume then why not fit dozens, even hundreds? I tend to like weapons that are sized in proportion to the ship.

Good point, but submarine torpedo bays aren't all that big right?

Same idea...

Confusion about separation capability. It's said that the ship was designed with separation as a possibility... but there's only two impulse engines, so apparently the separated ship would have warp only on the engineering hull, and impulse only on the saucer. I don't like that.

I've seen a couple of pics with impulse engines where one of the cargo bay doors used to be on engineering hull. But those weren't canon of course.

[Mikey]

Good point, but submarine torpedo bays aren't all that big right?

A better analogy would be comparing the amount of PT's stored aboard a starship with the number of 16" shells carried by the USS New Jersey.

[Captain Seafort]

In terms of total ammunition stowage they're pathetic, although the GCS isn't so bad in terms of rounds per launcher. The E-A carried 80 PTs, and the E-D 275. Battleships typically carried at least 100 rounds per gun, and KGV and Rodney both fired well over three hundred rounds at the sinking of the Bismarck.

[Graham Kennedy]

Good point, but submarine torpedo bays aren't all that big right?

Same idea...

I've been in one. It was the second biggest area on the boat (the engine room was first).

In terms of storage, I've said elsewhere the photon storage capacity of a Federation starship is utterly, utterly rubbish. You can fit 600+ photon casings on a basketball court sized room one deck high. For the E-D to carry only 250 or so is just plain stupid. Ten thousand would be a far more reasonable figure for a vessel of its size.

[LaughingCheese]

Good point, but submarine torpedo bays aren't all that big right?

Same idea...

I've been in one. It was the second biggest area on the boat (the engine room was first).

In terms of storage, I've said elsewhere the photon storage capacity of a Federation starship is utterly, utterly rubbish. You can fit 600+ photon casings on a basketball court sized room one deck high. For the E-D to carry only 250 or so is just plain stupid. Ten thousand would be a far more reasonable figure for a vessel of its size.

Yes that does seem rather low.

[Sionnach Glic]

I find that to be one of the most annoying things about the E-D. Yeah, I have a whole list of complaints about the ship, but just storing 250 torps is excesively stupid.

[LaughingCheese]

I find that to be one of the most annoying things about the E-D. Yeah, I have a whole list of complaints about the ship, but just storing 250 torps is excesively stupid.

lol

Like windows?

[Graham Kennedy]

Windows don't bother me none. Assume that the exterior windows are transparent duranium or transparent whateverthehellium, and that that is as strong as regular hull material. Further assume that "quantum inversion welding" or whatever is used to fix the windows in place, and that such joins are also as strong as regular hull material. Upshot being, a hull with windows is just as strong as one without. Voila.

Re photon torps, it must be more than 20 years ago that I read "The Making of Star Trek", but I swear I remember reading that the original concept for photons was that they are M/AM contained in a magnetic field. No casing, engine, or anything else solid, and the ship was therefore limited in how many it could fire only by the fuel reserves available. Cool idea, I thought.

[RK_Striker_JK_5]

Now that would make sense, Graham.

[Sionnach Glic]

If they'd kept that idea, it would be far easier to rationalise the 250.

Maybe the UFP is suffering a M/AM shortage, and thus their ships are operating with only a skeleton armament?

[Aaron]

Good point, but submarine torpedo bays aren't all that big right?

Same idea...

Quite large relative to the size of the boat as Graham points out. Consider that a modern US SSN can carry about as many torpedoes and missiles as the E-A and the modern weapons are a fair bit larger than a PT (length wise at any rate).

[Sionnach Glic]

They can?
Jesus, never would have guessed that.