Post War Fed Shipbuilding

[McAvoy]

Perhaps. But really, if every Federation ship was equipped with those weapons and the batarmor, there no amount of pressure of war that would seriously threaten the Federation.

We know the batarmor is very effective against Klingon warships when used on a shuttle.

If the technology was banned for political reasons, then the other powers would have given something up. If the E-E was batarmor equipped, the Nemesis battle would have been very different.

[Tsukiyumi]

I could see treaty/political issues. The Son'a used weapons that were banned... so these could have been going through political debate as well.

That's a great point; for all we know, transphasics could be subspace weapons, and would therefore already be banned.

The armor is another question altogether. Voyager slapped it on in what, a few days?

Maybe the Temporal Prime Directive bans the wide deployment or study of either, but Voyager using it to get home was too big of an event to simply "undo".

[Tinadrin Chelnor]

If the technology was banned for political reasons, then the other powers would have given something up.

Did the Romulans give anything up with the Treaty of Algeron? The Neutral Zone was reaffirmed, so no-one lost anything, but the Federation gave up the pursuit of cloaking technology (officially). I don't recall the Romulans giving something up, so perhaps the Federation would accept a ban on some advanced technology just to keep the peace. Although that sounds silly, all things considered, I'd expect TNG Federation to do that more than I would expect it from DS9 Federation, for example.

[Jim]

If the technology was banned for political reasons, then the other powers would have given something up.

Did the Romulans give anything up with the Treaty of Algeron? The Neutral Zone was reaffirmed, so no-one lost anything, but the Federation gave up the pursuit of cloaking technology (officially). I don't recall the Romulans giving something up, so perhaps the Federation would accept a ban on some advanced technology just to keep the peace. Although that sounds silly, all things considered, I'd expect TNG Federation to do that more than I would expect it from DS9 Federation, for example.

One could say that the Romulans gave up the active persuit of conflict... war or expansion. The Romulans are a warrior race, the Federation is not. So the UFoP gave up cloaking to gain peace of mind against attack/war. ??? maybe...

[Captain Seafort]

One could say that the Romulans gave up the active persuit of conflict... war or expansion. The Romulans are a warrior race, the Federation is not. So the UFoP gave up cloaking to gain peace of mind against attack/war. ??? maybe...

I've said it before and I'll probably say it again - the only sane explanation for Algeron is that the Tomed Incident was a catastrophic Fed defeat, and the cloaking ban was imposed on them by the Romulans as part of a victors' peace.

[Mikey]

One could say that the Romulans gave up the active persuit of conflict... war or expansion. The Romulans are a warrior race, the Federation is not. So the UFoP gave up cloaking to gain peace of mind against attack/war. ??? maybe...

I've said it before and I'll probably say it again - the only sane explanation for Algeron is that the Tomed Incident was a catastrophic Fed defeat, and the cloaking ban was imposed on them by the Romulans as part of a victors' peace.

Or - at least as likely, given what we've seen - the UFP is a bunch of nancies who are afraid to step on anyone's lawn.

[Captain Seafort]

Or - at least as likely, given what we've seen - the UFP is a bunch of nancies who are afraid to step on anyone's lawn.

We're talking about the early 24th century here, less than two decades after Starfleet's top brass were advocating all out war with the Klingons to take advantage of their post-Praxis weakness. While I could understand the mid 24th century Feds accepting Algeron rather than stand up to the Romulans, at the time of Tomed the high command would be comprised of officers who served their early careers during the Klingon Cold War, and would be steeped in the traditions and attitudes of that period.

[Deepcrush]

I've said it before and I'll probably say it again - the only sane explanation for Algeron is that the Tomed Incident was a catastrophic Fed defeat, and the cloaking ban was imposed on them by the Romulans as part of a victors' peace.

There's this or that the Tomed Incident was a political shift-cause which put both sides to barter. Romulans give up expansion in exchange for the UFP giving up cloaks that they weren't using at the time anyways. The Romulans seem to have been constantly out played by the UFP and prior that the United Earth Starfleet. At some point the RSE had to accept that its chance to knockout the UFP had come and gone. So they needed to find someway to get a peace that would save face for both sides.

[Jim]

Or - at least as likely, given what we've seen - the UFP is a bunch of nancies who are afraid to step on anyone's lawn.

We're talking about the early 24th century here, less than two decades after Starfleet's top brass were advocating all out war with the Klingons to take advantage of their post-Praxis weakness. While I could understand the mid 24th century Feds accepting Algeron rather than stand up to the Romulans, at the time of Tomed the high command would be comprised of officers who served their early careers during the Klingon Cold War, and would be steeped in the traditions and attitudes of that period.

Agreed, but there is a difference between potentially picking fights with a race at full strength... and trying to take out the injured limping race like the Klingons after Praxis.

[Deepcrush]

The Klingons weren't limping by any means. The problem was that they couldn't afford a war and save their population at the same time.

[McAvoy]

Also, it wasn't like that explosion wiped out half the fleet either.

[Deepcrush]

The problem for the Klingons, or anyone for that matter is that even if your whole fleet is intact. You're still going to have problems if you can't get access to your supplies, reinforcements or replacements. Having a moon explode over your homeworld will cause trouble like that.

[McAvoy]

Of course, naturally. I don't remember offhand but Praxis wasn't their only place to get supplies or reinforcements but it was their biggest one right?

In the end though even the Klingons felt they knew they could not win any war with the Federation at that point.

[Deepcrush]

Being its their homeworld, its likely that most of the population and supplies they have come from there. Still, losing your homeworld's aid to a conflict while no doubt cripple any Trek empire.

[Mikey]

I think the other problem with the loss of Praxis was that it supplied the vast majority of the Klingons' dilithium.