Gamma Mission Prep

[Blackstar the Chakat]

I'm saying the ship should be more powerful, regardless of whether we need it or not.

Why?

[Reliant121]

exactly?

[Thorin]

I'm saying the ship should be more powerful, regardless of whether we need it or not.

Why?

To add to the ST universe we're RPing in?

[Blackstar the Chakat]

I'm saying the ship should be more powerful, regardless of whether we need it or not.

Why?

To add to the ST universe we're RPing in?

How is going from battleship to wanktastic going to add to it?

[Thorin]

How is going from battleship to wanktastic going to add to it?

It won't.

I've already said I don't want the wanktastic, I want something that fits the description of a pure breed battleship that is 20 years ahead of the Sovereign. Not a Borg Cube, but then again not a marginal improvement on a 20 year old science vessel.

[Sionnach Glic]

What if we say it was built around the same time as the Sovereign? Would that do?

[Thorin]

If that's the case it might aswell just be a Sovereign. It's just not a match to other capital ships, even though it seems the Feds have the ability to match other's one off mega-ships, and the battleship was made in that light. I don't see the need to use that ship, or at least to use those numbers.

[Mark]

The way I see it, I always a matter of give and take. If we juice up the weapons and shields some more, we are going to have to give up something on the other side, for the sake of role playing. Less powerful sensors, technical glitches due to design flaws, not enough power on the ship to power everything at once, so on and so forth. I agree that it should be a bit more powerful, incorporating the next generation in LOGICAL weapons evolution, but if we field a "supership" where will the drama and anxiety factor come from? One such concession I made in a previous Trek roleplay, where we incorportated Battlestars (ie Galactica-all treked out) that while a Battlestar could go toe to toe with a Starbase in firepower, she was unholy slow, topping out at Warp 9. So we COULD deliver massive firepower with ships weapons and with fightercraft, but by the time we got anywhere, the fight would be mostly over. But it was a REALLY bad idea to attack the thing.

Not suggesting we use Battlestars, but you guys see my point?

[Monroe]

And in both cases it hasn't

Well that's not my fault

[Teaos]

Ahh have you read the stats of our ship?

You yourself said the Sov can almost take out the Scimitar which is the most powerful ship around.

This ship has well over tripple the armour, considerably more powerful shields, torpedo fire power that is stronger and beam weapons that can knock out anything around it.

This ship can take on and two or even three capital ships of the other powers and win. It is built to Federation designs and power.

[Thorin]

This ship has well over tripple the armour, considerably more powerful shields, torpedo fire power that is stronger and beam weapons that can knock out anything around it.

According to DITL, which is what we do go by...

The Paladin's shields are 50% stronger than the original Sovereign, a 20 year old exploratory vessel. By comparison, that 20 year old exploratory vessel has shields a whole 100% improvement on a ship (Galaxy) 10 years older than itself. The shield energy has doubled in 10 years - I find it very good practice to continue that trend - especially considering that the Sovereign wasn't even built as a warship! Continuing this trend, and taking into account it's a warship, would give the Paladin shields of at least 25 million TJ. I think that about 17 TJ is a rather good compromise.

The Paladin's torpedo fire power is only 40% up on a exploratory vessel that is 20 years old. In comparison, the Sovereign's torpedo firepower is 500% up a shield 10 years older than itself (Galaxy). Continuing that trend, and taking into account it's a warship would give the Paladin torpedo a whole 150,000 on Graham's indices - or about 50 quantum torpedo launchers. This is clearly ridiculous, but I don't think asking for some more than 6 launchers - 4 of which are sub-sub standard - is unfair. Personally, I think about 6 quantum rapid fires (or a combination of others to give an approximate equal strength index [16,000]) is good compromise.

The Paladin's phaser fire power is 100% up on a 20 year old exploratory vessel. By comparison, the Sovereign's phaser power was 70% up on a ship 10 years older than itself (Galaxy). Continuing that trend, and taking into account it's a warship would give the Paladin a phaser power of about 350,000 TW. I actually think this one is pretty reasonable; it's not too far ahead of the current design either, but it adds credibility to the chronological technological design process.

And don't respond with saying the Sovereign had a peak in the trend, because I've offered compromises to cover that - even though there's no evidence to suggest it was.

This ship can take on and two or even three capital ships of the other powers and win. It is built to Federation designs and power.

So can the Sovereign. Correct me if I'm wrong - I only voted on one of the polls - but this ship was made to be as good as SF can do. The Sovereign, besides being 20 years old, was not. It was made with science in mind. Just because it could pack a punch doesn't mean SF couldn't do better, it just means they didn't perhaps need or intend to. The design of this one was made to be THE best. To see what SF can do.

My maths is pretty sound, and I'll be very dissapointed if I get another response of "we don't want the wanktastic fanboy ship", because it's NOT. It's in line with the Paladin's design brief (ie best warship SF can do), AND is in line with the ST universe. There is no fanboy-ness to it. I'm being reasonable here and have properly thought about it, but the responses are not warranting what I'm writing, simply "nah that doesn't feel right" doesn't cut it if you can't provide reasonable evidence - like I have done - other than we don't need it, which I have already addressed: it does need it as per its design brief (to be the best), and to add credibility to our little old RP here.

Teaos, I appreciate the ship you've built there, but my 'calculations' here are based objectively, your limitations on the ship - the percentages - are purely subjective.

[Blackstar the Chakat]

Well, a lot of advances were made in the ten years between those ten years. Regenerative shielding, quantum torpedoes, ablative armor, all of which came from the need to fight the Borg and later the Dominion. Since there is no major threat in the inbetween time weapon and defensive technology hasn't had to advance as quickly.

[Thorin]

Well, a lot of advances were made in the ten years between those ten years. Regenerative shielding, quantum torpedoes, ablative armor, all of which came from the need to fight the Borg and later the Dominion. Since there is no major threat in the inbetween time weapon and defensive technology hasn't had to advance as quickly.

And don't respond with saying the Sovereign had a peak in the trend, because I've offered compromises to cover that - even though there's no evidence to suggest it was.

Added to the fact that even with all those improvements you mentioned - the Sovereign was not built to be the best warship SF could make. The Paladin is. The Sovereign, were it made as a warship, would be stronger than it currently is - indeed (by Graham's indices), stronger than the numbers we get for the current design of the Paladin.

[Mark]

Well, a lot of advances were made in the ten years between those ten years. Regenerative shielding, quantum torpedoes, ablative armor, all of which came from the need to fight the Borg and later the Dominion. Since there is no major threat in the inbetween time weapon and defensive technology hasn't had to advance as quickly.

And don't respond with saying the Sovereign had a peak in the trend, because I've offered compromises to cover that - even though there's no evidence to suggest it was.

Added to the fact that even with all those improvements you mentioned - the Sovereign was not built to be the best warship SF could make. The Paladin is. The Sovereign, were it made as a warship, would be stronger than it currently is - indeed (by Graham's indices), stronger than the numbers we get for the current design of the Paladin.

Thorin, your arguments were well researched and your argument convincing. I don't know if it will count for much, but you've swung me over to your side

[Blackstar the Chakat]

On another much more minor point, are we going to be using the 'future' uniforms and comm badges? We're in the 90's right? The badges were about 15 years after Voyager, so I think we'd be using those at least, and I think the earliest example of the uniforms was 2395, but I don't see no reason why we can't or shouldn't use them now. There were my favorite versions of the uniforms.