USS Stargazer

[Sionnach Glic]

He was retreating from a then-unknown enemy. He may have put the lives of his men over the destruction of the ship they abandoned.

That was foolish. His priority should have been to keep his ship out of the hands of this unknown hostile enemy at all costs. Ships have self-destruct systems for just that reason.

[Blackstar the Chakat]

He was retreating from a then-unknown enemy. He may have put the lives of his men over the destruction of the ship they abandoned.

That was foolish. His priority should have been to keep his ship out of the hands of this unknown hostile enemy at all costs. Ships have self-destruct systems for just that reason.

And if it was offline like it was in Nemisis? I'm of the opinion that your men's lives are the priority, except for specific situations and missions. This was not one of those situations. The Stargazer is an outdated underpowered science ship, not a top of the line battlecruiser

[Sionnach Glic]

And if it was offline like it was in Nemisis?

Then he strolls down to Main Engineering and blasts the warp core with his phaser. Problem solved.

I'm of the opinion that your men's lives are the priority, except for specific situations and missions. This was not one of those situations.

How could this possibly not be one of those situations? The ship was about to be captured by a completely unknown and apparently hostile race. For all Picard knew this could have been the prelude to an all-out invasion of the Federation. It was his duty to prevent the ship falling into enemy hands at all costs. In this situation the crew is expendable.

The Stargazer is an outdated underpowered science ship, not a top of the line battlecruiser

Irrelevant.

[Mark]

Granted. But he'd already destroyed the enemy vessel. There was not an "immediete threat" of another hostile showing up, or they would have picked it up on sensors. It would only have taken seconds to a few minutes to "make sure" of Stargazer, right? I mean, let's look at is this way. Assume for a minute that Bok wasn't crazy, and acted like every other Ferengi. He had a mostly intact Federation starship, complete with a working computer core, phasers, photon torps, and a propulsion system. He sort of had Starfleet by the balls with all of the tech he COULD have sold to say, the Romulans, who, I'm sure if nothing else would love an example of some good shield technology. No matter what he "thought", he allowed a hostile power to "capture" his Starship. What would happen in the modern US Navy if a Captain let his ship be taken, somewhat intact? His a$$ would be in a sling.

[Mikey]

anti-matter annihalates any matter it touches. There may not be a lot of debris left from an anti-matter reaction.

Not really. Antimatter can only annihilate an equal mass of matter.

[Sionnach Glic]

Granted. But he'd already destroyed the enemy vessel. There was not an "immediete threat" of another hostile showing up, or they would have picked it up on sensors.

That's a pretty big assumption. You've just been attacked by a race you've never encountered before. You know nothing of their capabilities. They may have cloaks, or faster warp drives than you. Assuming that if you leave your ship in the middle of hostile space unguarded you can come back and pick it up later is a massive assumption to take.
If he felt he was in no danger, then he should have stayed on the ship and waited for help to come to him.

[Blackstar the Chakat]

How much could the Ferengi even get from an outdated science ship anyway?

[Mark]

Granted. But he'd already destroyed the enemy vessel. There was not an "immediete threat" of another hostile showing up, or they would have picked it up on sensors.

That's a pretty big assumption. You've just been attacked by a race you've never encountered before. You know nothing of their capabilities. They may have cloaks, or faster warp drives than you. Assuming that if you leave your ship in the middle of hostile space unguarded you can come back and pick it up later is a massive assumption to take.
If he felt he was in no danger, then he should have stayed on the ship and waited for help to come to him.

But after leaving his ship, it wasn't recovered. It was captured by the Ferengi. The fact that, that IS what happened kind of sets the tone for whether or not he should have destroyed Stargazer before abandoning it. He know that they'd be in those shuttles for weeks. That's just to long to leave your ship floating around ANYWHERE near a potentially hostile power.

[Mark]

How much could the Ferengi even get from an outdated science ship anyway?

What we consider outdated to another species COULD completely change not only the natual evolution of that species but could change the balance of power for several worlds at least. But to use my previous example of the Romulans. Most everybody on the forum agrees that they have inferior shielding, right? If they were to capture one of our starships intact, they could take apart the shield generators and disect the systems and eventually even the programming codes for our computers, so they could pull schematics as well. Now they have our technology from which to build on as well as their own. So, by the time of say the DW, the Romulans are now fielding ships with comparable shields to our own. How would that effect the balance of power in the entire quadrant?

[Blackstar the Chakat]

How much could the Ferengi even get from an outdated science ship anyway?

What we consider outdated to another species COULD completely change not only the natual evolution of that species but could change the balance of power for several worlds at least. But to use my previous example of the Romulans. Most everybody on the forum agrees that they have inferior shielding, right? If they were to capture one of our starships intact, they could take apart the shield generators and disect the systems and eventually even the programming codes for our computers, so they could pull schematics as well. Now they have our technology from which to build on as well as their own. So, by the time of say the DW, the Romulans are now fielding ships with comparable shields to our own. How would that effect the balance of power in the entire quadrant?

Once again, outdated science ship. I doubt it'll have top of the line shield generators or something. As for 'natural evolution' that ends about the time you develop the wheel. Or at the very least when they come up with warp travel.

[Mark]

How much could the Ferengi even get from an outdated science ship anyway?

What we consider outdated to another species COULD completely change not only the natual evolution of that species but could change the balance of power for several worlds at least. But to use my previous example of the Romulans. Most everybody on the forum agrees that they have inferior shielding, right? If they were to capture one of our starships intact, they could take apart the shield generators and disect the systems and eventually even the programming codes for our computers, so they could pull schematics as well. Now they have our technology from which to build on as well as their own. So, by the time of say the DW, the Romulans are now fielding ships with comparable shields to our own. How would that effect the balance of power in the entire quadrant?

Once again, outdated science ship. I doubt it'll have top of the line shield generators or something. As for 'natural evolution' that ends about the time you develop the wheel. Or at the very least when they come up with warp travel.

Ahh....so then it wouldn't have been a really big deal if Voyager HAD given the Kazon, say, an outdated replicator???

[Blackstar the Chakat]

What we consider outdated to another species COULD completely change not only the natual evolution of that species but could change the balance of power for several worlds at least. But to use my previous example of the Romulans. Most everybody on the forum agrees that they have inferior shielding, right? If they were to capture one of our starships intact, they could take apart the shield generators and disect the systems and eventually even the programming codes for our computers, so they could pull schematics as well. Now they have our technology from which to build on as well as their own. So, by the time of say the DW, the Romulans are now fielding ships with comparable shields to our own. How would that effect the balance of power in the entire quadrant?

Once again, outdated science ship. I doubt it'll have top of the line shield generators or something. As for 'natural evolution' that ends about the time you develop the wheel. Or at the very least when they come up with warp travel.

Ahh....so then it wouldn't have been a really big deal if Voyager HAD given the Kazon, say, an outdated replicator???

That's different. That's technology that they didn't have yet.

[Mikey]

It's not up to the captain to say, "I don't have to scuttle the ship, because I arbitrarily say that this case isn't a big deal." He should have destroyed it because that's what the captain should do, regardless of the particulars of who may or may not recover it.

[Blackstar the Chakat]

It's not up to the captain to say, "I don't have to scuttle the ship, because I arbitrarily say that this case isn't a big deal." He should have destroyed it because that's what the captain should do, regardless of the particulars of who may or may not recover it.

It was a scientist, with a scientist in command. It wouldn't be in his nature to put it's destruction ahead of his crew's lives.

[Mikey]

"His nature" has to be subordinate to the dictates of the position of captaincy. It doesn't matter if he's a scientist or a fireman; if you are the captain of a vessel, you must do the things that captains are supposed to do.