End of Enterprise-D

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:59 am

Teaos wrote:Maybe there is a reason they are always there. I mean almost every species follows that rule so maybe there is some universe truth to putting a bridge there. If not everyone does it anyway so everyone has the same weakness.

The only advantage is the ease of swapping out bridge modules. The Romulans have a slightly more sensible design with the Warbird, where the bridge is only vulnerable at the front, and the Defiant's is sunk into Deck 1, surrounded by that semi-circular ridge. Beyond that the fact that everyone is just as stupid does not make it less stupid.

Post by **Teaos** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:02 pm

Beyond that the fact that everyone is just as stupid does not make it less stupid.

If I didnt already like my sig quote I'd use that

intrepid35 · Post by **intrepid35** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 5:57 pm

For anyone wanting to see a truly noble, spectacular end to a ship, check out Battlestar Galactica, "Exodus, Pt. 2" and the destruction of the Pegasus. I do wish the Enterprise-D had gone out in a similar fashion. I wonder what will become of the Enterprise-E, and what happened to Enterprise-B?

Post by **Teaos** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 3:04 am

Remember that the majority of the crew had to survive thus the options become a bit more limited.

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:37 am

Teaos wrote:Remember that the majority of the crew had to survive thus the options become a bit more limited.

Why? Obviously the command staff had to survive, otherwise there wouldn't have been a series of TNG films, but having the crew suffer massive caualties would have further emphasised the drama of the moment. The big problem with the end of the E-D (and Kirk) was that it didn't really mean anything. The E-nil was destroyed over Genesis to help save Spock. The E-A was reduced to scrap over Khitomer to save the chance of peace between the Klingons and the Federation. The E-C was destroyed at Narendra and led to the Federation-Klingon alliance. The E-D? Destroyed by an obsolete lump of scrap and a badly designed warp core saving a planet we've never seen before and will never seen again. Ugh. What was worse was that James T. Kirk died doing the same thing. Double Ugh.

Post by **Teaos** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:14 pm

How can the command staff survive and no one else? seems a bit far fetched they could get to life pods or something and the rest of the crew doesnt. i also cant see them leaving the rest of the crew to die ever.

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:42 pm

Teaos wrote:How can the command staff survive and no one else? seems a bit far fetched they could get to life pods or something and the rest of the crew doesnt. i also cant see them leaving the rest of the crew to die ever.

I'm talking from an OOU dramatic perspective more than an IU technical perspective. In Generations virtually the entire crew survived, with no mention of casualties. I'm not advocating the command crew surviving while everyone else dies, more the ship either being destroyed or suffering irreparable damage, with the crew suffering huge casualties (think hundreds, rather than the few dozen that usually get mentioned) but the command crew simply not being among those lost.

Sionnach Glic · Post by **Sionnach Glic** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:13 pm

The command crew were mostly all on the bridge anyway, it would be easy for major damage to be done to the ship but not the bridge.

Crushproof · Post by **Crushproof** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:20 pm

intrepid35 wrote:and what happened to Enterprise-B?

Decommissioned in the way of the Ent-C, became the Lakota in the Dominion war.

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:54 am

Crushproof wrote:
intrepid35 wrote:and what happened to Enterprise-B?
Decommissioned in the way of the Ent-C, became the Lakota in the Dominion war.

Or was decommissioned and scrapped in the 2320s, or destroyed in the Tomed Incident. I've seen all three suggested in various places.

Crushproof · Post by **Crushproof** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:30 pm

Captain Seafort wrote:
Crushproof wrote:
intrepid35 wrote:and what happened to Enterprise-B?
Decommissioned in the way of the Ent-C, became the Lakota in the Dominion war.
Or was decommissioned and scrapped in the 2320s

That would have it in service for less than 30 years. I think being destroyed is more likely.

SolkaTruesilver · Post by **SolkaTruesilver** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:55 pm

what's the Tomed Incident?

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:48 pm

From various sources - mainly "The Neutral Zone" and "Pegasus" - it was a Fed-Romulan clash in 2311 that led to thousands of dead and a severe Federation defeat, probably on the scale of Wolf 359. As a result of it the Federation signed the Treaty of Algeron, banning them from developing or using cloaking technology.

Post by **Graham Kennedy** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:47 pm

I don't think anybody ever actually said it was a defeat. It's often assumed that it was, since the Federation had to accept not having cloaking devices, something we assume they wouldn't have wanted to accept. But on the other hand the Romulans retired from contact with the Federation for 53 years after the Tomed Incident. If it had really been a big success for them, one might expect that they would have pressed forward rather than falling back.

I suspect the Tomed incident was something of a draw. Both sides expected to win, but both sides suffered badly and failed to gain whatever their objectives were. So both suffered a hell of a shock that rocked them back on their heels for a good long time.

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:52 pm

I don't see how it could have been anything but a severe Fed defeat, given the one-sidedness of the treaty. It may have been that the Romulans decided that they'd made their point, gained a major advantage, and decided not to push their luck.